Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus Forum (No Salvation Outside the Church Forum)
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.
Latest topics
» The Unity of the Body (the Church, Israel)
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyThu Apr 04, 2024 8:46 am by tornpage

» Defilement of the Temple
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyTue Feb 06, 2024 7:44 am by tornpage

» Forum update
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptySat Feb 03, 2024 8:24 am by tornpage

» Bishop Williamson's Recent Comments
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyThu Feb 01, 2024 12:42 pm by MRyan

» The Mysterious 45 days of Daniel 12:11-12
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyFri Jan 26, 2024 11:04 am by tornpage

» St. Bonaventure on the Necessity of Baptism
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyTue Jan 23, 2024 7:06 pm by tornpage

» Isaiah 22:20-25
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyFri Jan 19, 2024 10:44 am by tornpage

» Translation of Bellarmine's De Amissione Gratiae, Bk. VI
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyFri Jan 19, 2024 10:04 am by tornpage

» Orestes Brownson Nails it on Baptism of Desire
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyThu Jan 18, 2024 3:06 pm by MRyan

» Do Feeneyites still exist?
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyWed Jan 17, 2024 8:02 am by Jehanne

» Sedevacantism and the Church's Indefectibility
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptySat Jan 13, 2024 5:22 pm by tornpage

» Inallible safety?
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyThu Jan 11, 2024 1:47 pm by MRyan

» Usury - Has the Church Erred?
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyTue Jan 09, 2024 11:05 pm by tornpage

» Rethink "Feeneyism"?
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyTue Jan 09, 2024 8:40 pm by MRyan

» SSPX cannot accept Vatican Council II because of the restrictions placed by the Jewish Left
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyFri Jan 05, 2024 8:57 am by Jehanne

» Anyone still around?
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyMon Jan 01, 2024 11:04 pm by Jehanne

» Angelqueen.org???
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptyTue Oct 16, 2018 8:38 am by Paul

» Vatican (CDF/Ecclesia Dei) has no objection if the SSPX and all religious communities affirm Vatican Council II (without the premise)
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptySun Dec 10, 2017 8:29 am by Lionel L. Andrades

» Piazza Spagna - mission
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptySun Dec 10, 2017 8:06 am by Lionel L. Andrades

» Fund,Catholic organisation needed to help Catholic priests in Italy like Fr. Alessandro Minutella
St. Seraphim of Sarov?? EmptySun Dec 10, 2017 7:52 am by Lionel L. Andrades


St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Go down

St. Seraphim of Sarov?? Empty St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Post  Roguejim Fri May 13, 2011 5:59 am

If you scroll down the page at the link below, you will come across this exhortation by a Benedictine Prior at a Clothing Ceremony, i.e., the giving of the monastic habit to a new brother:

"...Finally, I place you under the protection
of the venerable and God-loving Saint Seraphim of Sarov,
a monk-priest of the Russian Orthodox Church,
who was born on July 19, 1754..."

http://vultus.stblogs.org/2011/04/become-like-a-consuming-fire-1.html

Blessed John Paul II apparently also made mention of this saint(?) in Crossing the Threshold of Hope.

So, my question is how an Orthodox monk can be a saint. One Catholic religious told me that a schismatic can never be a saint. I emailed the Prior with my question, but did not receive a satisfactory answer.

Roguejim
Roguejim

Posts : 211
Reputation : 315
Join date : 2010-12-18
Location : southern Oregon

Back to top Go down

St. Seraphim of Sarov?? Empty Re: St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Post  Guest Fri May 13, 2011 9:20 am

Actually Jim, I ran into this very questions several years ago because I am very interested in the Eastern Churches. Apparently the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith allows the celebration of the feast days of post-Schism "Orthodox" saints in the Eastern Catholic Churches. This has been going on since pre-Vatican II times. I think Pope Pius XII was the first to allow it.

This book talks about that issue:
http://www.amazon.com/Confessor-Between-East-West-Ukrainian/dp/0802836720

There is also a book about Blessed Leonid Feodorov which I own that talks about this issue. I will have to find the appropriate section and to type it up.

The idea in doing this is that many times the Orthodox Churches were separated from Rome in good faith. The schism was not really solidified in many places until 200-400 years after the "official" year of the schism in 1054. In fact, Vladimir Soloviev points out that the Russian Orthodox Church never make a formal declaration of schism against Rome.

I still do not know what to think of the issue. I think perhaps it is wishful thinking on the part of those who desire unity. The idea is that if the Russians reunited to Rome and could not celebrated the feasts of their national saints that would be too much for them to handle.

The issue becomes REALLY sticky when you go to a Byzantine Catholic Church here in the States and they are celebrating the feast of "Saint" Gregory Palamas, who had heretical theology AND called the Pope an antichrist in his writings. How this man can be a saint I have no idea.


I will post more resources about this. I think there is an article in Tradition in Action on this matter.




Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

St. Seraphim of Sarov?? Empty Re: St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Post  Guest Fri May 13, 2011 9:34 am

Pius XII and the Russian ‘Saints’

Atila S. Guimarães


http://www.traditioninaction.org/HotTopics/b020ht_RussianSt.htm

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

St. Seraphim of Sarov?? Empty Re: St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Post  Roguejim Fri May 13, 2011 2:33 pm

Thanks for the article.

I wonder if the Orthodox Church would have declared that these saints shared the same exact faith as the Roman Catholic faith.

Were these saints invincibly ignorant of the heresies they held, if they in fact held any? It seems that we cannot admit for a second that these saints were in schism without denying Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus as well. This is a can of worms that I am not competent to sort out.
Roguejim
Roguejim

Posts : 211
Reputation : 315
Join date : 2010-12-18
Location : southern Oregon

Back to top Go down

St. Seraphim of Sarov?? Empty Re: St. Seraphim of Sarov??

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum